Matt Sodnicar 0:02
So I wanted to start the conversation just by you had an Instagram post a few weeks ago about being a younger woman, and the challenges you had getting preventative care, even with breast cancer in your family and wanted to start with that.

Stephanie Villavicencio 0:25
Yeah, there always seems to be extra steps in trying to schedule my mammogram screenings, which for me are preventative because of my family history. And in this specific circumstance, it was a matter of the people on the other end of the phone, either misinforming me, and had I not known from previous years trying to schedule my appointments, listening to them and either giving up or not trying harder, but instead being able to say, hey, actually, these are the things I know and you need to give me what I'm asking for. And one of the one of the things which was ridiculous was my receptionist at my gynecology office telling me that I'm not mixing it up, not the gynecology office, see? Oh, yeah, it was, um, she said, that first, I needed a appointment with my gyno before they could write me a referral for my mammogram and being under 40. You cannot get a mammogram without a referral. You can't just call up and say, Hey, I have family history, I'd like to schedule my mammogram. And I told her, I was like, No, the last two years that I've seen the doctor, they didn't need me to come in first, you guys just sent over the referral. And she just said, Oh, okay. You know, so he was wrong. And, you know, tried to steer me around and give me additional steps. And luckily, I knew what they had done for me in the past, you know, to bypass that. And then, at the the Diagnostic Center, they aren't fully aware of different insurance plans. And it would be helpful if they were because it would have saved me the extra 30 minutes of calling my insurance company, because my insurance company gives me coverage for the calendar year, not 365 days plus one, like other companies do. Yes, they weren't gonna let me schedule my mammogram because it was within 365 days. So I had to call my insurance and they said, no, no, you're good. If you haven't used your complimentary mammogram coverage, then you're free to use it whenever you want in the year 2023. And so I kind of had to drill that into the Diagnostic Center to get them to schedule me. And there's kind of this back and forth for me to get my appointments. penciled in

Matt Sodnicar 3:33
this in no way compares, but I'm still trying to find a primary care physician for my new health plan. And the insurance company sends me a list which last time I looked at look like it was a photo of a paper scan of like something that fell on the floor. And I called three of these people and two of the numbers weren't even working anymore. And one was like, oh, no, we're not taking new patients. And this is just for PCP. And I can't imagine the frustration you're going through trying to get something where it's so very important to you, and your family history and your health care. Trying to get that dialed in. I mean, was it you said like you were doing this for five hours on your Instagram posts, something like that? No, it was

Stephanie Villavicencio 4:25
just say, like, an hour worth of trying to get my appointments but being put on hold and then hanging up because sometimes you get the feeling they forgot about. And then it makes me think if this is my third or fourth year, you know, practicing getting my screenings. How hard is it for women in my situation, who have yet to try? And then how much harder? Is it for women without family history, who actually have a concern, and it's critical that they get out these screenings and treatments.

Matt Sodnicar 5:03
What do you think the friction is there? Is it? My first guess would be cost. But why do you think it's so hard to get this done for you?

Stephanie Villavicencio 5:15
I think the biggest thing is the national guidelines that state that I believe they've changed it from 50 to 40. This was a recent change. But they say women under 40 Basically, don't need to get screened and don't need to worry about breast cancer screenings until a certain age and I think when everyone's told that, and you can't just call and get what you need. That's where all that friction comes from.

Matt Sodnicar 5:54
And you know, from quite personal experience that you do need to worry about this. Under 40.

Stephanie Villavicencio 6:04
Oh, yeah, since starting to see it for breast cancer, it's become extremely apparent how many people under 40 are affected and diagnosed and some of whom do not survive their diagnosis.

Matt Sodnicar 6:22
Well, this might be a good time to talk about Nadine. Right. She was the origin, the flashpoint for tits deep and let's talk about her a little bit and her role in this. Yeah, so

Stephanie Villavicencio 6:35
Nadine was one of my best friends. And she lived here in Aspen. We both taught snowboarding at buttermilk mountain here in Aspen. And in June of 2020, she was diagnosed with stage three, triple negative breast cancer, triple negative is extremely hard to treat. And she was 31 years old. And after going through 16 rounds of chemo, and a double mastectomy, which once she had her double mastectomy, her oncologist had cleared her of any signs of cancer. And that was in March of 2021. And then come November of that same year, she started experiencing pain in certain parts of her body. And woman was in and out of the ER and doctor's appointments and scans. And they didn't catch it, which was very frustrating. And then by March of 2022, her cancer was so aggressive that it took her life that had spread, you know, well beyond the breasts into her head, her left arm, her lungs and in her spine. And she didn't have family history. And she did share with me that her primary care doctor randomly decided to write her referrals for mammograms, which is a really unique case, because I haven't heard of anyone else having that experience. And that was the reason she found her tumor in the first place. So it was found at stage three. But imagine if she wasn't being given that opportunity, you know, how much less of a lifespan she would have had.

Matt Sodnicar 8:42
And that's where tits deep started was to help her and help other women in this situation, right?

Stephanie Villavicencio 8:50
Yeah, well, it was originally to help her. She had expressed a lot of stress around surmounting medical bills, and of course, the inability to work and cover her costs of living. And the immediate thing that I thought I could do was raise some funds for her. And I spent many months thinking of a clever and witty catchphrase. And just, I mean, it's one of the best light bulb moments I've ever had. But I was driving home from the grocery store. I remember the sun setting over Snowmass Village. And I was like, oh my god hits deep. And it's so funny that it took me so long to think of that term because as a snowboarder living in a ski and snowboard time, it's such a common term that we say when it's a big powder day. You just say like, sweet. It's a Tete deep powder. Actually, it's deep and it's just an epic, deep powder. You say it, and Nadine and I were The Best of powder buddies, she'd be the first person I call. And usually the only person I'd ride with on a powder day, as you know, no friends on a bad day. Oh, that's right. Yep. And so just really fitting. And I didn't tell anybody what I was up to you, I just consulted in my friend who's an artist and graphic designer, and told her my graphic concept. And when she sends it back to me, she recommended I do stickers. So I ordered a box of 250 stickers. And I did the math, I was like, if I sold these for $5 times 250, that's around $1,250, I should be able to raise that. And that'll be the end of it. And I'll be really, really stoked that I helped my friend. And literally, I showed up to buttermilk mountain in my snowboard instructor uniform, with perfect pockets for those stickers, I literally felt like a drug dealer, and I like whip them out. And I just told people why I was selling them in for who and it was really easy because that mountain Mountain is very mom, palm, we all know everybody. And literally from that day to day five of selling stickers I had sold out. But not only that, I had a running list of back orders of people who had sent me money, and we're not waiting on stickers. And so then I ordered another box, and then I ordered another box. And instead it was 1000 stickers. And in less than two months, I had mailed stickers to, you know, countries like England and Australia and multiple territories in Canada and beyond. And we were able to bring in just over 11,000. But more than that, there was a big need for support people were opening up to me and sharing how they've been affected. And that's kind of when I took the idea and ran with it and continued to grow it since February 2021.

Matt Sodnicar 12:06
That's amazing. And I love that you didn't start necessarily with an end in mind. But you started with helping your friend. And I think with the most pure intentions, people can sense that and not to make it like a business comment. But

that just resonates with folks. And there's there's no way you could mark it that like in being very sensitive and think about Nadine and your mom and everybody else. But it's just cancer has touched everybody. And just stepping up to do that to be a great friend that's people connect with that. That's awesome. How much of the how much of that did Nadine see

Stephanie Villavicencio 13:08
the fleece started in February of 2021. She saw essentially the first full year of Tootsie. That's great.

Matt Sodnicar 13:25
Do you recall the impact that that had on her?

Stephanie Villavicencio 13:30
Well, when I showed up to our apartment after the first two months, and I was able to hand her cash, and Venmo her the rest. She was just so stoked. It was just so cool to just it was so casual, you know, like the most unglamorous thing but she was just super grateful. And the month before she passed away, I had, I had planned out a women's ski day. And it was a fundraiser to benefit our overall mission. So more women. But when I realized that needy and needed more help, because she was so sick, and there was really nothing that I could do. I thought that I would donate everything raised from that single women's ski day to her and I didn't tell her I don't think I told anybody really, um, that also felt really good. And that would have been like, two and a half weeks before she passed away. So I imagined that my money would have really, you know, more helped her partner than her and I can't really imagine the kind of position that he was in so that also felt really big for me because when you're are in a position where there's nothing you can do and you're asked to give that person space, but you can still donate a decent amount of money, that feel it feels really good.

Matt Sodnicar 15:17
That's such a touching story. I really appreciate you sharing it in that way. It takes me back to, I'm quite a bit older than you are. But I lost my mom when I was 22, this real aggressive cancer, and you lost your mom when you were two. And I was just thinking about days in my life where I think I've crossed the threshold where I've been alive longer without her than I was with her. And just thinking about days where it was when my kids were born that I really, it was the first Mother's day it was the first Christmas as always those first that were tough. And then it seems out of the blue, there would be times where this would be really great to have her around. And

Stephanie Villavicencio 16:18
yeah, how?

Matt Sodnicar 16:20
I guess the maybe it's like an obvious question. But what do you think was different about your life play? Because you never really knew her? Right? You were to when when you grew up? What? Do you reflect on that at all? Yeah, do you allow yourself that latitude to look that direction, definitely,

Stephanie Villavicencio 16:38
I feel very open to it, but also being too, and not having those memories, which I just learned from my twin brother, he actually does have memories of her being sick. And in a bed, oh, BB things and, you know, IV tubes. And so that's really fascinating. Because we're both there in the same room, same age, same exact moment. And I don't have any recollection of any of it. And I think that plays a big part in coping, because I don't have any deep seated memories attached to those. Those really difficult days. So for me, it was living life differently than everybody else. But never really understanding the the extremity of what we went through until I found out that an Indian got diagnosed because she was 31. I was 30. And my mom passed away at 33. And so all of a sudden, I'm this grown woman getting close to the age that my mom was. And so I have this for me firsthand perspective of what what it's like and how hard it would have been for my mom, or my dad, or my grandma, or my mom's friends. And, of course, for me and my siblings. And that's, that's where my passion and drive to help Nadine came from. But in terms of being raised without my mom. Really, it's quite resilient because it is such a impactful story. But I can talk about it in a really empowering way because of the way that my grandmother who was her mother raised us. It was cool. Robins gone. What did we do with the kids. My father wasn't in a position mentally, emotionally or financially to raise us full time single handedly. So my grandmother actually adopted the three of us became our legal guardian, brought us into her home, put us through school. She was really well off financially as a retiree. But when she started funding three little kids, she actually had to go back to work. And when you're adult and you make your money, you realize how humbling that is. And we would see my father on the weekends, and he was a big part of our life and awesome dad. And neither my dad or my grandma ever planted that seed of being the victim of our story. It was more like, Let's survive, and let's make this work. And your grandma is at times your mom and your dad. And yeah, it was a little different. But when we were there in those moments, it it didn't feel like we were this weird, a nucleated family it just it was was what it was. And nobody ever really talked about breast cancer. or my mom's passing. So when I was in my early 20s, and had to really start thinking about early detection treatment, which was like pulling teeth for me, that's when I really had to face that which felt a little lonely. Because who do you relate to when you have two brothers and your grandma's gone, and you have a dad, you know, so that I kind of had to figure out on my own, with a little bit of help from certain women in my life.

Matt Sodnicar 20:36
I think that that acceptance that your dad and your grandma had helped cultivate is huge. It was something I had carried forward as I like to say I was a know it all perfect. 20 something. Idiot, dude, when my mom died, and I, for a while I carried with it that my dad was really good about.

Yeah, life is for the living, let's not forget it, let's move on and thrive as best we can. But I do remember. Took me a few years to get over this. But I felt that my life should be easy now. Because I've experienced this trauma of losing my mom. And I don't know if it was being, you know, young and dumb and entitled, or just thinking that I had experienced enough. But it took me a while to shake that and get to a point where you're, you're your new different family looked at things and it gets there's a lot of therapy, and it was a lot of perspective over those those years. But just Yeah, that sounds like an amazing perspective that they both had to help you through this.

So tense deep. What are your plans for the future for this? Like, if you could interview future Stephanie, five years from now? What would what would you want her to tell you that this has become

Stephanie Villavicencio 22:25
that it's become bigger than you could ever anticipate? That you shouldn't get caught up in the little things or get overwhelmed by things you haven't accomplished or things you're not doing because, for me, I started it to help a friend. So really, Tootsie is just one big beautiful accident. And I kind of want to stay true in that. I don't ever want to force anything what to do. I want it to be natural. And I really want to make decisions that feel good. Even if it takes me 12 months to make the decision even if it takes me 24 months. And some things have taken me that long. And I would really like in a few years time to look back and hope that I've achieved my dream of doing a titz deep winter tour where I go to different mountain towns in the west and do events or speaking engagements, and pop up shops and create more impact in communities beyond Aspen which we are doing. But I'd love to see it at a higher level. And I would imagine and hope that I've met even more incredible women in the outdoor adventure space who I've networked with, and can not only call a friend but also an awesome partner or sponsor, and really just building upon everything that I've built up to this point.

Matt Sodnicar 24:11
I think that tour idea sounds phenomenal. I think that would be tell me more about that. When you when you talk about that. What what do you see that? How do you envision

Stephanie Villavicencio 24:22
envision road trips to the different mountain towns and setting up you know, smaller scale seminars on awareness, education and advocacy where we're able to bring in local experts, providers, survivors and young women affected by family history where we can share our knowledge, information and support to a crowd. I really love the concept of going to college campuses such as UC Boulder and MSU and connecting with the college crowds and Different clubs that might resonate with tickets deep. And I've been in conversation with a club called back country squatters, which is now national across many different universities. And I'm also just getting people super stoked on tickets deep the brand, but also our mission. And you know, kind of having that ripple effect. If you share it with one person, they're gonna go out and they're going to share it. And if they put a sticker on their skis and sit next to the right person on the chairlift, they might have this really impactful conversation, and actually just had somebody email me in that exact thing happened where the sticker on their skis created a little bit of discomfort. But that's only because the person sitting next to her lost her sister, to breast cancer at 30. And didn't quite know how to open up. But the person with the sticker is a survivor. And it created this really safe space for the both of them. And if I could pull it off, along with the tour, creating partnership partnerships, so for example, if I were to go to MSU, and find a local clinic, such as Bridger, that could somehow get younger women to go to this clinic for their breast health support. I think that could be really good for all the communities that I in theory would visit.

Matt Sodnicar 26:42
I asked that question. You know about the tour to get into more detail, because I'll look this up for you. But I heard about this on. I think it was Debbie Millman podcast. And I'm blanking on the name, but it's, I'm gonna look it up, because I want people to listen to it. Oh, design matters with Debbie Millman. And it was an exercise that she did when she was an undergrad. And I hope it's her but a credit to her. But you write this down in explicit detail. You just pick a point, you know, some years away, and write down what time you got up what you had for breakfast, where you're on all these things. And you know, whether it's goal planning or intention, or, you know, I tease about manifesting sometimes, but visualization, whatever it can possibly be. I think once it can be seen in your mind, anybody's mind, then it exists. And then it's kind of like, was it Michelangelo that says, I'm just removing the bits that are not the sculpture, you're just doing that. And so it was it was fun to hear. You start really articulating that vision. And I believe it

Yeah, Cancer sucks. I lost a friend about three months ago that he'd been fighting for about two years. And it's just yeah, that feeling of helplessness because I'm not a doctor. I don't know any of this stuff. But you know, I kind of saw my role is just a clown just to go entertain and, you know, break his balls occasionally and just, you know, just try to establish some sense of normalcy, that it's just, it's rotten and to be I don't care what age you are, you're always too young. And for Nadine being 31, and your mom and it's just it's just a terrible thing. I wish I was more profound, but I can't really articulate it any more than that. It just sucks. So,

when you're looking at the would you call it early stage or, like, What are you talking about somebody in their 30s for breast cancer? Like, what were some things you've learned about? Nadine and your mom that you communicate to younger women now.

Stephanie Villavicencio 29:38
I would say be diligent, learn your body. So that if any changes do occur, occur, you are aware and you can act upon it. I would say to be your own best advocate. Because when doctors dismiss you and they don't take you serious asleep, or they're Miss informing you, you can stand up for yourself and fight for what you need, even if it takes you longer, even if it means going through multiple positions and not ignoring symptoms, because I hear a lot, that if a woman finds anything alarming, they try to justify it by their youth and their health. And that can really set you back and it can make your symptoms more critical, the longer you wait.

Matt Sodnicar 30:48
I think about that a lot to being a amateur cyclist and somewhat of a runner and an athlete, like I deal in fat biker skiing every once in a while. But

these things involve discomfort, your legs start burning, or, you know, whatever. And that's something I've had to remind myself is that, oh, pay attention to how long this particular sensation sticks around was this was a heavy volume week for being on the bike and skating, or is it something that's hanging around, and I've started a little in my phone, a little

injury log, but just sort of like, okay, this is when I first noticed this, and I'm still experiencing it in a little bit to track it down and see.

Stephanie Villavicencio 31:42
But yeah, I think, yeah, because

Matt Sodnicar 31:46
I don't think anybody really wants to know, but you have to know because you've if you know, then you have more time, you have a better chance. I get the I get the fear. Yeah. Yeah, not ignoring the symptoms. I actually wrote that down, and I'm underlining it for myself.

This is a question somewhat out of ignorance. But in your experience, do you feel that female doctors are more receptive? Do you think that just because of the shared

biology and physiology that perhaps that might be more conducive to early detection and early mammogram? Have you noticed?

Stephanie Villavicencio 32:37
Well, I can't speak fully from experience because I've only had one women's health physician, he's a male. But from the stories I've heard of other women who shared with me a lot of the negative stories come from male doctors, but I think I recall also female doctors, dismissing their patients, um, and then having the really amazing ability to connect with physicians on a more personal level through Ted's deep who have become ambassadors or who have, you know, become comrades, they seem to be incredibly compassionate and supportive of their patients.

So

it's really hard to say because I'm sure that sometimes gender doesn't play a role in how the patient seeking medical attention is treated.

Matt Sodnicar 33:44
I would hope not. And again, I had no frame of reference and as I was asking that question, I was just thinking more in terms of if I would give advice to my daughter, so I was just curious about your actual experience. Yes.

Stephanie Villavicencio 33:59
I'd be curious myself I would in the future I would rather find a female physician for sure.

Matt Sodnicar 34:13
Well, I love the stickers I'm going to place an order after this because it definitely it definitely fits my vibe and I think the I love the story of the like you working on the problem of the name and then giving your brain space that it just landed like a feather on you and it was just perfect like I love stories like that that's so cool

Yeah, so what's what's next on Making the tour a reality what's what's your next big project you have go

Stephanie Villavicencio 34:51
first I've got a reach out to my connections in different places. I've recently been nailed. A friend who has a business in Denver to do a pop up shop collaboration with, um, her business is hoo ha. And she does retro women's ski apparel and she is a breath of fresh air and she's been super supportive. Matt, I need to reach out to my connections in Bozeman, and potentially Tahoe. I don't want to spread myself too thin. But I also want to dream big. And then we also have a big local event here in Glenwood Springs, Colorado, which is in the same valley as Aspen, called Bhutan festival. And oh, yeah. So good. My friend, Jenny founded it. And we've had a couple of calls on, you know, incorporating tips deep into the festival beyond being a vendor, although being a vendor is the best ever and we will be there. But just thinking of ways that we can really bring more light to to see it. And a couple of other things that aren't coming to mind, you know, some some more local events to Aspen and Colorado, in the works.

Matt Sodnicar 36:18
Tell everybody about Bhutan, because like I said, this is

Stephanie Villavicencio 36:24
always Jenny, your effing amazing. And Bhutan festival is the world's largest female and femme ski festival, this will be its third year, and they're blowing it up, they're gonna sell a lot more tickets. And it's basically a space for women and femme folk, to come together to celebrate us and our and musicians and female founded brands, and to ski together and do a naked ski lap and really just bask in how amazing it is to be surrounded by so many women on the snow in that way.

Matt Sodnicar 37:17
I went to one of the film screenings last year, and it was she did such a good job with the production. And I actually made it very clear that hey, you know, I'm a dude, do you mind if I come to this and I read the ticket page multiple times. And it was very welcoming. And the movie, I'll see if I can find the link and post it in the show notes. But the movie was just the way that she produced it. That the it was not full frontal there was these cool graphics over the the private parts, I'll just say. But it just it started fading into the background. And I remember towards the end of the movie, I thought, Oh, I wasn't even really thinking that these women were naked. It was just seeing the smiles and the skiing and the camaraderie and the friendship and it was so well done. It's a fun, so well done in a way I gotta admit, I was somewhat get out envious of that experience, because dudes would never do that. But just celebrating each other. I think that's what I took away from it was just the pure celebration and lifting each other up. And so many different body shapes and styles and just everybody having a blast. It was one of those brilliant ideas and yeah, I still every time I think about it, I'm like, Oh, how can I get involved in that? And it's like, I don't know that I can but financially, maybe financially. But yeah, that is such I'm not surprised that you knew each other and if you didn't, I was like you've hang up this and then go caller right now because it's such a good fit. Such a good fit. Cool. Well, what else do you want to talk about? This is this is your platform. I'm enjoying this and I like your vision and your, your approach to this. What else is important?

Stephanie Villavicencio 39:40
What else is important? Um, well, we're still really even though it's been it'll be three years in February. I would say Ted's deep is still in its infancy even though at times we have reached goals that, you know, to me were somewhat unfathomable but As you know, you can't do everything all at once. And so I've really focused on the branding and the merchandise side of things, because I've just had a lot of fun with it. And I don't want to get burnt out or overwhelmed. But there are a couple of things that are at the forefront that I really want to tackle. And I just haven't yet and one is creating a platform where people can actually call themselves community members. And I do consider a lot of people community members, but I really want to create that tangible space where people can sign up and be a part of a community. So really figuring out how to build that online and you know, what platform to use, and hopefully, that will elevate the amount of connections and support through people being able to network with more than just say, the 17 people that come to one day event, or the people who can only connect to me on Instagram, because I'm the only one answering the DMS and also being able to connect different founders, or executive directors or board members or survivors or providers, or people who do podcasts in the breast cancer space to come together and see how they can collaborate beyond me, you know, me and remove to do because there's room for everyone to come together. And maybe they share a different vision that I can't or that I'm not interested in. But it's really important. I love connecting people. And I'd love to see, the people that I'm talking to in the emails have the opportunity to also create together. And then the biggest thing, which I'm still fundraising for, but don't have quite the ability or resources to accomplish it is a way to offer grants to women under 40. Without access to early detection and treatment. So slowly but surely. But that's definitely one of the bigger goals of the mission. And I'm really glad that every day I work towards that. But it'll be really nice when people ask me and I get to see Yeah, like, go to this link on our website and apply here. Or, Oh, you have a friend that can't afford their mammogram, or you have a friend that simply won't pay for it. Because of the cost cool, send them here and have them apply for the grant and we'll do the best we can to help them obtain access to their mammogram.

Matt Sodnicar 42:59
In my mind, it's already happened. He just got to get there. It's just a question of when because, like I said, if you can define it, you can create it and you've done the hard part, you've named the problem. So I have no doubt that it's going to happen and it's just cool to meet and just be part of this journey with you. So awesome. Well, Stephanie, where can people get signed up and get engaged and get tickets deep in this effort,

Stephanie Villavicencio 43:30
the website which is tips DT for breast cancer.com. And you can always connect with us that way through the contact form and at the bottom of the main page, putting your email into the newsletter to stay up to date with events and product launches, etc. The place where I'm the most active is Instagram, which is at tits deep for breast cancer. That's also the same name for the Facebook page. And I created a Tik Tok which I haven't put too much attention on which is also at Tootsie for breast cancer. I

Matt Sodnicar 44:11
don't have a dance worked out yet for Tik Tok.

Stephanie Villavicencio 44:16
Yeah, I just did so much work. I just have to pick one social media platform and put all my efforts into that.

Matt Sodnicar 44:27
Yeah, I never figured out Snapchat and I look at Tik Tok and I was like, you know, I just I'm gonna let let those two go. I'll work on Instagram. Well, Stephanie, this has been great. I'm so happy we finally connected and I look forward to supporting what you're doing as best I can. And to anybody listening. Go grab some stickers and put them on your skis, put them on your helmet, put them on your car and don't ignore those symptoms get out and Make people aware might save a life

Stephanie Villavicencio 45:04
Thank you Matt It's been really awesome being on your podcast and chatting with you

Matt Sodnicar 45:10
yeah thanks for the time I really appreciate it

Transcribed by https://otter.ai